Dear Owners of This Media Collective

"JohnnyWasASchoolBoy" (JohnnyWasASchoolBoy) 09/10/2020 at 16:28 • Filed to: None

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Your new layout blows. I mean it really, really blows. When I first saw these layout changes over at Gizmodo there was something about the new look that I couldn’t put my finger on. I chalked it up to just having a short attention span and an intense need for straight lines in print or print-analogue layouts.

Then I saw this abominable layout show up at Jalopnik. “Shit,” I thought, “here we go again.” Weird, sometimes-horizontal/sometimes-vertical layouts, boxes of different sizes and aspect ratios, content that looks like it was puked up on the screen; Gizmodo v 2.0.

Then, it hit me. I know why I hate this so much.

The new box-based layout provides camouflage for the ad boxes at the bottom of the screen. No longer are the ad boxes a distinct element, easily scrolled past. Now, the content boxes look like the ad boxes.

You fuckers (site owners, not the writers) are changing layout to try to get people to click on the ad boxes - erroneously thinking that they’re content - and drive your revenues.

Fuck. You.

I have been visiting Jalopnik (under a different user name) since well before the “I think that’s a Lambo”, “GTFAC”, “Cotomer sevis”, “Brefass Scotch” and “Jalopnik Gold” memes; l ike, years before.

I’ve lived through layout and Kinja changes, said goodbye to writers and editors, and seen the banning of some really funny commenters.

This shit, is the worst. You should be ashamed.

WasGTIthenGTOthenNOVAnowbacktoGTI > JohnnyWasASchoolBoy 09/10/2020 at 16:49

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Content ain’t free.

I don’t like it either, but you have to admit that’s it’s clever of them to hide it that way.

Ad Block Plus is everyone’s friend.

EDIT: I’ve also been reading Jalopnik regularly for almost 10 years, so I get the hate, I just don’t think it’s worth my time to get bent out of shape about it anymore.......

PowderHound > JohnnyWasASchoolBoy 09/10/2020 at 16:49

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A little tip I gleaned from the post about their design switch. Use this link instead of the homepage :

https://jalopnik.com/latest

E90M3 > JohnnyWasASchoolBoy 09/10/2020 at 16:50

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Yeah but did you lament more over this or the demise  of ca.jalopnik.com/oppositelock? 

user314 > JohnnyWasASchoolBoy 09/10/2020 at 16:57

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Yup. That’s pretty much the size of it. 

ttyymmnn > PowderHound 09/10/2020 at 16:59

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Every G/O site has a “latest” button that bypasses the seizure-inducing new layout. 

TheBloody, Oppositelock lives on in our shitposts. > E90M3 09/10/2020 at 16:59

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Uh, da memories. 

ttyymmnn > WasGTIthenGTOthenNOVAnowbacktoGTI 09/10/2020 at 16:59

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Every time they make our experience worse, I am reminded of exactly how much I am paying to be here. 

user314 > WasGTIthenGTOthenNOVAnowbacktoGTI 09/10/2020 at 17:02

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And that’s fine, we all understand the need for advertising and whatnot, but the way they go about it, the constant layout changes that make the user experience worse , the bugs that apparently will never be fixed? That’s all stuff a competent  organization would address. We’re not getting that from the Herbs than run this place. 

ClassicDatsunDebate > JohnnyWasASchoolBoy 09/10/2020 at 17:04

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Look familiar?

https://web.archive.org/web/20101015000909/http://www.forbes.com/

user314 > ttyymmnn 09/10/2020 at 17:04

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That fact alone is a tacit admission that they know they’re fucking the site up, they just don’t care .

JohnnyWasASchoolBoy > WasGTIthenGTOthenNOVAnowbacktoGTI 09/10/2020 at 17:08

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I know. And I appreciate what it costs me to be here, consuming this content. I get it. It’s the nefarious shit that bothers me. I’ve never complained about anything here except for this new layout and the click-through slide shows.

I worked in advertising for a few years and left because of the deceit. 

PowderHound > ttyymmnn 09/10/2020 at 17:11

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I really only visit the homepages of Jalopnik and The Takeout which hadn’t changed layouts so I never knew about the “latest” button. Might get me to visit some of the other sites now

Jb boin > JohnnyWasASchoolBoy 09/10/2020 at 17:12

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To me it feels like some of the guys who are taking “decision” react to “we are not making enough money” by “let’s put more ads” and when they finally realize it’s not working any better “let’s change the things around the ads so peoples will finally click on those same ads” even if it ends up making the “things” around the ads worse than it was in the first place.

ps: i have such a boss.

JohnnyWasASchoolBoy > PowderHound 09/10/2020 at 17:13

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Brilliant. Thanks

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > JohnnyWasASchoolBoy 09/10/2020 at 17:14

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Would you pay for Jalopnik? Genuinely curious.

I paid for Defector recently, first time I’ve ever paid for online media ever

CivicWagonEngineer > WasGTIthenGTOthenNOVAnowbacktoGTI 09/10/2020 at 17:14

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I throw my hat in on uBlock origin. Lighter weight than ABP and doesn’t have paid white lists. Also uBlock origin is open source

WasGTIthenGTOthenNOVAnowbacktoGTI > user314 09/10/2020 at 17:16

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True. And if I paid one penny for it, I’d be furious.

I don’t like it, I just understand where it sits in the bigger picture.

WasGTIthenGTOthenNOVAnowbacktoGTI > CivicWagonEngineer 09/10/2020 at 17:16

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Fair enough!

JohnnyWasASchoolBoy > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 09/10/2020 at 17:26

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Interesting question. If I recall correctly, you’ve been here almost as long as me so I hope you can take my answer at face value.

Yeah, I think I would if the situation required it. In the old days when things were a little more free-wheeling I absolutely would have. It would have felt like I was directly supporting these amazing content creators, writers, drivers, and irreverent characters.

Now, in the Herb days... I think I’d feel like I was lining Herb’s pocket rather than supporting Torch and crew. That said, if the site depended on a subscription or donation, yeah I think I would. The content is still the best automotive writing around and the people are amazing.

I send wikipedia some money when I’m using them heavily, I send a couple of podcasters money when I use them heavily (even though I technically pay for their content via Spotify Premium). I do believe in supporting good content. 

Jim Spanfeller > JohnnyWasASchoolBoy 09/10/2020 at 17:27

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Jalopnik has gone so far downhill since I first started reading it... And I only started reading it what, 4-6 years ago? I remember when there were lots of great writers and a fantastic community in the comments, and new articles were posted frequently so you always find something new... Now the number of commenters is smaller and the comments themselves are just d ownright hostile. Jason and David are the only writers that keep me coming back. I mean Bradley is a good writer as well, but he’s too hostile and ban-happy. The other authors seem to have recognized that Jalopnik is going down and have jumped ship to better sites. Places like The Drive have articles that remind me of the old Jalopnik, but the comment community there is tiny. On the bright side, the downfall of Jalopnik is largely what led me to Oppo, which is in a lot of  ways better than Jalopnik ever was. I just wish Kinja was less... Kinja-y.

Exage03040 @ opposite-lock.com > JohnnyWasASchoolBoy 09/10/2020 at 17:30

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I get the struggle with ads and revenue but how they’ve been presented is assaulting. To the point it’s legitimately killing peoples browsers (like on my phone) . If it’s not stable without a blocker, then how they expect to both get revenue and engagement?

I also get the feeling that the nice big lead spot will be occupied many times by thos e loosely car based cross - posting articles. You know, the ones with a 300+ comment section crap-slinging .

First post in roughly 2mo to FP comments and I already had to dismiss a bait comment from a nitwit. Well, b ack to being productive...

Chariotoflove > JohnnyWasASchoolBoy 09/10/2020 at 17:32

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A lot of the stuff annoys me in little ways. But the one new design element i loathe  is the intrusive “ you may also like” boxes trying to link me to other kinja blogs. I don’t click them, but they flash their clickbait garbage titles in my face. You can’t prevent your eyeballs from flitting to that corner and subjecting your mind to their their self entitled, judgmental , outrage culture messages. It’s like if you put child porn images there. I don’t want to see it, I won’t click on it, but they impress that garbage onto my retinas before I can do anything.

Khalbali > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 09/10/2020 at 17:32

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Me too, partially because I was hoping some jalopnik alumni could end up there someday. 

lone_liberal > JohnnyWasASchoolBoy 09/10/2020 at 17:34

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What gets me is that they are sacrificing readability in order to game ad statistics. They don’t give a shit about people actually reading the content as long as the numbers look good. If this wasn’t true then they’d fix the fact that because of the ads and design decisions their sites are totally  unreadable on Chrome on Android.

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > JohnnyWasASchoolBoy 09/10/2020 at 17:39

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I think that your answer mirrors how I feel.  I would have 100% purchased Jalopnik gold back in the day.  Now?  Maybe on a different site 

Exage03040 @ opposite-lock.com > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 09/10/2020 at 17:39

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Should be question of the day!

Pre Mid April 2020: Yes

Post Mid April 2020: Hell No

Mercedes Streeter > JohnnyWasASchoolBoy 09/10/2020 at 17:47

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I can live with Jalopnik having this layout. I’ve been reading Jalop forever then a commenter and Oppo author since the 2013 launch of Kinja. To this day I believe Jalopnik and The Drive are the best sites for auto content out there. Most other places feel like their authors copy/pasted press releases. There’s no emotion, no flair.

Aaaaaaanyway, I think this layout is definitely a bit too cluttered, but it doesn’t really move my needle. Now if the devs made the communities like Oppo adopt  this layout...that would be chaotic.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 09/10/2020 at 17:52

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Nope. But I’d pay for OPPO.

ttyymmnn > PowderHound 09/10/2020 at 18:19

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Set the “latest” as your bookmark and bypass the insanity altogether. 

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > ttyymmnn 09/10/2020 at 18:20

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They might be trying to drive us away and it might work.

RacinBob > JohnnyWasASchoolBoy 09/10/2020 at 18:20

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At first glance I don’t like it. It looks like Autoweek and Car and Driver which I think is OK for them but not for me and here. Maybe it’s what the eye’s they hope to get prefer but it’s not my cup of tee. I find I like being able to use my ”ratchetless” roller on my mouse to flip through content. This makes me stop and click, which I won’t do. I wonder what it will do to page views........

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > Exage03040 @ opposite-lock.com 09/10/2020 at 18:23

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What happened mid april? 

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com 09/10/2020 at 18:24

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Same, I’d pay like...a lot

If only EssExTee could be so grossly incandescent > JohnnyWasASchoolBoy 09/10/2020 at 18:28

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Never thought I'd say this but I miss the Tiger layout.

ranwhenparked > JohnnyWasASchoolBoy 09/10/2020 at 18:32

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I’ve adapted to so many layout changes over the past , what, 14 years? That doesn’t bug me, I get that nothing is free, making money is what keeps it alive. That said, I really don’t go on the FP anymore. Too many issues with comments not loading or the whole thing bogging down and scrolling real slow, just so many glitches that it hasn’t been usable in a long time. Also, there’s been a lot of turnover, and, frankly, the tone of a lot of the articles just isn’t as welcoming or entertaining as it used to be. A lot of judgmental, moralistic preaching and doom and gloom negativity, you start to wonder why someone would take a job writing for a car blog if they don’t particularly like or understand cars and car culture. The comments have gone way downhill too, lot of anger and negativity and sniping, shit people would never say to someone’s face in real life. The Kinja platform was supposed to be Nick Denton’s experiment to raise the level of Internet comments/discussions and blur the line between comments and content, but over time, its devolved to be not much different from what it was trying to replace. 

Otto-the-Croatian-'Whoops my Volvo is a sedan' > JohnnyWasASchoolBoy 09/10/2020 at 18:46

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Yep, I absolutely hate the ads. We’ll get used to the layout, however out of proportion and ugly it is, but the ads are killing me. My adblocker doesn’t even work on the site anymore? I have managed to minimize advertisement in my life down to just social media (I don’t watch TV or read the newspapers, and I have adblockers on everything) - but now I have to see them on Jalopnik. This is the only car-related site I regularly visit, and I feel like it’s FUBAR.

Exage03040 @ opposite-lock.com > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 09/10/2020 at 19:21

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*Politics and Rant *

I figure a directive came down from the top; Ballaban quit April 15 and the I feel there was a significant publishing   shift on FP noticeably   left politically and libertarian to match the rest of G/O.

I considered Jalopnik to be moderate liberal before but this was so distinct with Brad’ s Covid Doomscroll, Erik’s hate for pickups, Harleys, and cars in cities , Justin’s protest related articles against authorities , and Raph’s had some real left wingy stuff too, enough that the ban hammer was brought out. Many of which spawned some very toxic comment threads and occasionally combative authors. I find this very unfitting to what previous years were like.

We had departure of Alanis at the start of the year and Kristen at the end of March. Which brought the team down to just Erin and Erica. Lost Erica, gained back Elisabeth...

Then some point this year the   excessive ads came they have every time there’s a paragraph break or picture in the articles. The auto play videos. T hat silly slideshow format that borked the comments. And I see the newsletter pop-up is new as of a few weeks.

Even without this format change. FP hasn’t been recognizable to me for most of this year.

*takes breath and sighs*

2020 is such a shit show.

old-busted-hotness-still-cant-comment > JohnnyWasASchoolBoy 09/10/2020 at 21:49

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You only think it’s the worst because you haven’t seen what’s coming next.

All I know is my adblocker is showing triple digits and there’s still ads all over the damn place.

Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available > JohnnyWasASchoolBoy 09/10/2020 at 22:18

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Honestly I don’t mind it so much. It doesn’t change the way I view the content too much, though yes the ads look like content. You don’t have that problem with the sitemap. I made a post about it here.

https://oppositelock.kinja.com/lets-muck-about-in-the-past-kinja-implements-an-amazing-1844475399

Though the way Jason handled that post was great. Another good reason why we love him.

https://oppositelock.kinja.com/lets-muck-about-in-the-past-kinja-implements-an-amazing-1844475399

Stef Schrader > CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever 09/11/2020 at 04:16

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I got actual warm fuzzies when I scrolled through Defector’s comment section. Honestly, I think it’s the closest sensation to a group hug I’ve experienced in a long time. Here for those good-ass blogs.

They even brought Nibbles! Haha.

!!! UNKNOWN CONTENT TYPE !!!

I’d pay Some Guys for good car blogs, too, but that’s just me. 

Stef Schrader > Exage03040 @ opposite-lock.com 09/11/2020 at 04:30

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That is reading WAY too much into it. I don’t have any visibility into the other side anymore and can’t speak for Ballaban, either , but I can all but guarantee there are no directives to make the site fit a current political voice.

Z ero percent chance that herb is a far lefty pushing for far lefty things. ( For many , many reasons .) He wants control, and his fragile little ego wants to cram as many display ads onto things as possible. 

Stef Schrader > ttyymmnn 09/11/2020 at 04:47

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True, but I think of how mad it makes people, how it drives people away, and how everyone who works here deserves better. There are so many damn ads on the page that it’s getting extremely difficult just to Google my old work. That can’t be good for numbers on their end, either, and it points to the abject failure of the herbs-that-be to run this place competently.

I got curious, so I scrolled all the way down on the front page without an adblocker just to see how bad it was. The top, eh, it’s a website. A lot of folks have little category boxes, and hey, this might let them feature the big articles a little longer. There’s at least a clearly-marked button for all the blogs in reverse chronological order like readers (including myself) want.

The bottom—which is to say the middle, too—yikes. You know the “I can’t even find my own work” problem? Too many ads and Google mistakes your website for spam and downgrades it accordingly. The herbs are clearly too stupid to think of long-term consequences that would prevent those mounds of display ads from displaying to anyone, though, so here we are.

The “infinite feed” Taboola chumbox takes up a good three-quarters of the homepage if you’re dumb enough to scroll all the way down to the page footer. Three. Quarters. You expect to scroll down and see more from the website you’re visiting, right? That’s usually where you’d find the reverse-chronological-order blog feed on a lot of sites, after all. Not here! Enjoy some links off of the website entirely. Congrats to Car and Driver and Hagerty for scoring primo real estate on a competing website’s homepage, I guess. A handful of Jalopnik squares sneak in here and there, but a lot of the infinitely-scrolling Taboola chumbox is the kind of low-quality garbage Jalopnik actively stood against: laziness, weird sexism, blatant bait, listicles, etc., etc.

I rarely wish ill on anyone, but the world really would would be a better place if Spanfeller and his no-talent herbsociates were exiled to a deserted island with no internet.

Stef Schrader > ClassicDatsunDebate 09/11/2020 at 04:48

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Spamfeller isn’t even a creative no-talent hack. 

Stef Schrader > Jim Spanfeller 09/11/2020 at 04:50

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Comment more! 

(...and I do mean that h ere, there and everywhere—if no one comments because no one’s commenting, well, that’s a self-perpetuating problem.)

ttyymmnn > Stef Schrader 09/11/2020 at 09:10

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The “infinite feed” Taboola chumbox takes up a good three-quarters of the homepage if you’re dumb enough to scroll all the way down to the page footer.

I actually did this once. It’s amazing. Do they really think that people are going to scroll down through all of that?

All the ads might also be a sign of desperation. Is this place making any money for them? Because that’s the only reason it’s still around. 

Shift24 > JohnnyWasASchoolBoy 09/11/2020 at 09:48

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Woke up and checked the FP this morning and man.... is it bad. I have uBlock on so I dont see any ads but holy shit that is the worst layout I have ever seen. Its all broken up.

I came in to Jalopnik around 2012 because of an Expansion pack for Forza 4. That layout made sense and you could quickly get to the newest article and scroll through older ones that peaked your interest, it was very common to get new comments/replies from a post 2-3 months old.

Also people saying what about paying for Jalopnik or who ever is running the shit show, I come from an era of uTorrent, Napster, Piratebay, and Limewire.....

Fuck no I’m a Pirate, I aint paying for shit. I dont even pay for any streaming or music service.

If there is a way around it Ill find it , if there isnt (like this shit of a layout) I’m not wasting my time or money

Stef Schrader > ttyymmnn 09/11/2020 at 13:30

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Who even knows at this point. The sites were profitable on their own before Univision tacked its other debts onto them and the herbs bought them. They had a much bigger audience before they effectively shuttered two websites, including one of their most popular (Scabspin ain’t a replacement, either, as I still won’t click out of principle unless it’s a pre-walkout blog and I know I’m not the only one there) and a politics site in an extremely significant election year. They could’ve continued branching out into other forms of monetization, but apparently that’s above Jim’s pay grade. The brilliant events guy, Victor, was downright harassed before getting unceremoniously fired at the end of last year—he handled a lot of the co-branded events and such. The Studio desk I wrote a couple Porsche sponsored pieces for was apparently cut to almost nothing, and I haven’t seen any of their work nearly all year until just recently. I don’t know what else is going on back there per se, but the outward impression is definitely desperation, as you say.

Defector’s “welcome, we’re here, Actual Deadspin’s back” post was pretty eye-opening about just how much of a no-talent control-freak hack Jim Spanfeller really is :

Spanfeller spread himself wide on the couch next to my chair, and produced some spreadsheets which were meant to show me that over the last year Deadspin hadn’t brought in very many direct ad sales, and that this was a problem that needed fixing. I asked him, for the sake of clarity, if his plan to fix this problem was to refocus the site solely on sports and to scale up its traffic as much as possible. Perhaps not catching on to the question I was actually asking— So your plan to scratch out a few more direct ad deals is to undermine and antagonize the staff of a beloved and highly trafficked website while simultaneously asking them to produce millions of additional page views? —Spanfeller told me that, yes, that was his plan. I told him, calmly and clearly, that the former staff of Deadspin had no interest in executing that plan. 

It’s as if the herbs expect what worked in 1998 ad/revenue-wise to still work in 2020, a year where most of us are running adblockers for our own sanity’s sake and a pandemic has decimated all forms of display advertising.

ttyymmnn > Stef Schrader 09/11/2020 at 13:39

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Thanks for the long reply. 

Exage03040 @ opposite-lock.com > Stef Schrader 09/11/2020 at 15:31

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Hey Stef,

Perhaps I’m being overly skeptical but all the staff losses between the later part of 2019 to early 2020 haven’t sat well with me in regards to site content. Particular after Ballaban departed it was like muzzles had been taken off certain authors (and commentators). Now perhaps this was simply a product of the losses and not a order... I don’t know, it seemed oddly coincidental.

I know Covid lock-down made for some extremely slow news weeks at this time as well which could also explain this freedom as well as the jump to societal issues related to the passing and protests of George Floyd. H it and run over protesters being the vector . The thing for me was that Patrick covered Ferguson unrest back in 2014. He questioned the up-armament and military tactics of police to deal with situation. It’s very much in line with the current ‘defund the police’, yet the article is quite neutral and doesn’t chastise the men and women tasked to the situation, despite containing references of questionable use of force .

The writing this year , I can’t say the same . Naturally the comment sections are hellscape debates of the libertarian stance to block the roads, streets, and highways with demonstrations and protests. The depths of which are a disgusting read; I’m really at a loss to how many instigators and troglodytes have now infiltrated Jalopnik comments. The cost of clicks via recommended and cross-posting articles I suppose. While the stance is to societal happenings, it is naturally tied to a political leaning because of the polarization of your country. Particularly in trying to build a web with shares to The Root and Earther...

C ombined with the insatiable and relentless ad campaign as you describ ed has made me visit FP less, rarely click articles, and nearly quelled my engagement. I’m happy enough here viewing and contributing with the excellent people of Oppo . :)